Electronic Insurgent
As Tim mentioned earlier there’s been a bit of a brouhaha over the latest issue of the Student Insurgent, the University of Oregon’s student-run Marxist/Anarchist publication.
In their latest issue, the Insurgent Collective decided to print a number of depictions of Jesus in various poses. As a headline on page 11 of the issue makes clear, their purpose in printing the comics was to confront Christians. And as Collective individual “Jessica” says on page 16, “I have to say it is really fun to offend people.”
Regardless of content, people and organizations should not be censored for speech that’s considered “offensive” or “hateful.” Indeed, we support the publication and round denunciation of ideas and opinions which are bigoted or inappropriate. The best way to counter the free expression of bad ideas is with the free expression of good ideas.
Of course, the Insurgent collective does not necessarily agree with us. Last year, Collective individual Pira Kelly was one of the loudest supporters of the effort to defund the Oregon Commentator. She passed out pink armbands symbolizing the fight against free speech before our budget hearing. What a difference a year makes!
Anyway, we’ve put the Insurgent issue in question up in .pdf form since we have no ideological qualms about technology. Please note that it is not our opinion and does not reflect this author’s own views or beliefs. Also, since the format of their magazine was too wide for our scanner we’ve had to splice each page together. If a member of the Collective would like to put a better copy on the web, I know that I for one would appreciate it.
UPDATE: I notice that we’ve been getting a significant bit of traffic thanks to links from Hot Air and a few other blogs. For those of you who are new: thanks for visiting. You may have noticed that the Student Insurgent mentioned our own publication of the Muhammed cartoons as one of their justifications for printing the anti-Christian drawings. I encourage you to read the issue in question and decide for yourself if the Commentator’s presentation and editorial are comparable in tone and substance to the Insurgent’s. As always, I believe that context is everything.
UPDATE: You can find an archive of our blog’s coverage of the Insurgent (including more recent tidbits) here.
I am tired, grouchy and I don’t feel good today so I apologize if I have insulted anyone.
*sigh*
Andy I wasn’t trying to insult you or your job at McDonalds it was friendly advice. And I never claimed to be an English scholar. But you can argue the last fact with the Apostle Paul he is much more than a scholar than I am; I’m just a dumb Firefighter.
2 Timothy 3:16
All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,
Ps I’m willing to bet you dont have a sixth grade son.
Farmer,
My sixth grade son can write English much better than you can and God didn’t write the Bible either.
*shakes head*
Yes farmer,
rational thinking abilities at McDonald’s might be a vice – but in the real world of salaried jobs it’s kind of a plus.
To to the PhD, no one responded to you, mostly because most people know that University theologians have very little conceipt of the truth of the bible. Even the paper that printed the cartoons and the artist new they were offensive. I am proud to say my sixth grade son understands the bible more than most university PhD’s do. Mostly because he accepts the Christ of the bible and does not create one that fits his own mold and personal ideas. I hate to be insultive, but if you can’t accept the Christ of the bible don’t call yourself a theologian. Try reading your uncensored english bible you don’t need a degree to understand it. Or maybe your smarter than God and you can write your own bible.
Thank you to the producers of this website, I appreciate the open forum. Its almost therapeutic.
Hey i didn’t use the word hypocrite, oops drink
In answer to Timothy:
my last entry applies to you as well.
Timothy cute idea, but possibly not wise. We had a guy at work with similar ideas. Empahasis on the word had. Unless you want to start a home business, I would reconsider such ideas. Just friendly advice.
Heres an interesting conscept to ponder (we can’t tolerate intolerance).
People would be
fired, students expelled, and millions would be spent to appease those who
were offended.
Andy, How do you know that I am not?
I appreciate your wit though.
Well unless you want to do something about the direction our country is going in, Cheryl, I suggest you stop stealing oxygen.
I read this somewhere and couldn’t agree more: “I wonder what would happen if this same newspaper ran similar cartoons of
civil rights leader Dr. Martin Luther King? Can you imagine the uproar
there would be? Or what if they ran cartoons depicting Mohammed as a
homosexual? Those responsible would be in fear for their very lives. Or
what about if they ran cartoons that mocked and demeaned people who choose
to be gay. There would be marches and protests by
every pro-homosexual group that exists. The fact is, nobody would dare to
publish these types of disgusting representations of ANYONE other than Jesus
or Christians, since the public outcry would be deafening. People would be
fired, students expelled, and millions would be spent to appease those who
were offended.”
The people that write such disgust are weak pathetic excuses for human beings looking for easy targets, hiding under the guise of free speech. Makes one wonder what they are they are getting taught in the schools/universities they attend.
And this will be the future of our country? The futures looking quite bleak indeed.
Farmer – Fair enough. I agree that pointing out the intolerance of a group while being intolerant towards them is a bit, er, absurd.
Ian you missed my point. The author of the cartoons was trying to make a point, but did the exact same thing that he was condemning. Making him and all those who cheer him hypocrites. That is my point, not that rape is the same thing. But as for as for rape or blasphemy goes I would hate to stand before God for either issue.
P.S. drink to hypocrite
I’d put an offensive picture in my cubicle just to bother people.
I’d put rape right below life-scarring torture but better than serious physical assault. I’d put offensive picture right below being spit on, but better than the finger.
If someone I dearly loved had been charicatured and printed as having a boner while on a cross, I certainly wouldn’t be happy. But I also wouldn’t think it was the same as them having been physically raped.
A person being raped is worse than a depiction of a person – or deity – being raped.
Ian and Niedermeyer, yes i do compare the attack on Christ and Christaianity to rape. I love no one more than Jesus Christ. You cannot understand my feelings, because you are not me. If you loved Christ as I do you would feel the same way. And yes I know what its like to be raped. I am not insulted by your comment I am just clarifying my position. If it was somone you loved dearly in those cartoons I hope that you would be furious, too.
Good point, also since half of the insurgent writers aren’t students. Good call Niedermeyer
I can’t decide if this is a really good time or a really bad time to point out the fact that the Collective gets a stipend while the Commentator doesn’t (don’t know about the Voice). Maybe mandating no stipends for any campus publication would improve the quality of content. Is that rule change possible since it affects all publications equally?
I dunno, nobody on staff gets paid either. I’m still paying for beer you made me drink, Ruff!
Actually, there is one wrinkle. I don’t want to pick on the KSA: I’m European, kind of, so I’ll use the European Student Association. Under viewpoint neutrality, the European Student Association cannot be defunded because PFC one year decides they’re a bunch of dirty Europeans who don’t deserve funding. They can have their funding cut if they’re just spending their money on pizza instead of organizing European Night or some pointless thing. In practice, this rule is interpreted rather loosely and the UO has an awful lot of pizza-munching, stipend-paying groups. But I, for one, would like to see it applied more strictly, and have the amount of pizza in the ASUO be drastically trimmed.
(NB: pizza is not served at Commentator meetings. In this way, and in absolutely no others, the Commentator is an ascetic among student groups.)
Ted – I was trying to grasp farmers viewpoint, but alas to no effect.
Yeah, that argument is getting mighty stale for me. I don’t get to eat the pizza that the Korean Students Association gets to eat when they have their meetings (hypothetically… be cool) but I pay for it, but you don’t see me calling for their defunding. Look, as fee-paying students, we pay for the opportunity to have print outlets for public expression , we are not paying for the right to like everything that comes out of those magazines. I write for the Commentator, and I don’t like everything we print! But I’m doing something about it. I am involving myself, rolling up my sleeves and contributing. Using the opportunity I help pay for, not bitching about how much it sucks. So maybe The Voice wants to give up, and the Talibs can use it to promote virtue and bible study and whatnot. Might even boost circulation.
Voltaire… I agree with it, I don’t like the Insurgent, but I acknowledge their right to speak and support that right…
But, with incidental fees, the principle is complicated…
“Whereas I may disagree with what you say, I will pay for your right to say it???”
Zach: The old saying “I don’t like what you have to say, but I will damn well defend your right to say it” comes to mind. 🙂
Andy, rape is a crime… with a victim. For anyone to claim that the effects of another persons/magazines speech is comparable to the effects of sexual assault is clearly ludicrous. Actually its almost funny… imagine reading this blog if every idiots opinion felt like rape.
Bigotry is always bigotry. The Insurgent is just another source of the growing anti-Christian movement in the U.S. that stoops to the lowest levels of human-kind to hurt people and cause them pain. Read my take
http://livebreathanddie.wordpress.com/
Ian,
All sins are equally bad???
Many of you cheer him like he is some kind of hero. Only hypocrites think that way. Would you cheer a rape, a murder, molestation, or a beating of a persons loved one in order to help them sympathize with another persons feelings?
Did you just compare a depiction of Jesus to rape?
*Sigh*
I am still shell-shocked that my little grievance started a huge movement garnering national attention from the likes of Bill O’Reilly and the loveable Bill Donahue.
I can’t say I stand behind every argument the newly formed coalition “Students of Faith” makes in their new grievance, as I believe that their arguments are misintrepreting legal issues and cases, and also suffering logically (I have suffered personally from this conviction), but I do strongly support their intentions and they have my sympathies. The Insurgent gets off from offending and insulting others, and the real shame is that they’re March issue did nothing to add to discourse on the problems of Christianity. There is nothing wrong with debating the perceived ills Christianity has had on society, but they’re ignorant, immature and arrogant rant only served to make people mad.
Something I have noticed which has reassured me of the sanity and good-will of this university is that virtually no one has come out and defended the content of the Insurgent. Some have defended they’re rights to publish, but I have not encountered anyone who has actually defended they’re content. The approach they used to make their points is indefensible and no rational or good-natured person could get behind it.
Learn to read.
Also: DRINK!
You are a Hypocrite if you believe that these cartoons of Christ are a good thing. Was the picture of Mohamed with a bomb on his head in a Christian publication? The author of the Jesus cartoons says that he was trying to teach westerners a lesson. Is it right to do evil to the innocent in order to get them to sympathize with others. The author admits that what was done to the Muslim faith was very wrong, (which I agree). Then he goes and does the same to the Christain faith. Many of you cheer him like he is some kind of hero. Only hypocrites think that way. Would you cheer a rape, a murder, molestation, or a beating of a persons loved one in order to help them sympathize with another persons feelings? Again it was not a Christain organization that printed the Mohamed cartoons. If you call Christians hypocrites, maybe you should look in a mirror, so you can have a better view of what a hypocrite looks like. Feel free to drink to the word hypocrite.
has always been challenged. Information and ideas, illustrations and commentary, are marks of a free society. Those who would enchain or enslave always limit, deter, badger, or attempt to control through the pocketbook those they disagree with. I salute the U of O student paper for its courage to print the “Jesus” cartoons. It is strange, to me, when Christians claim that Jesus was “true god and true man” and then attempt to lessen the “true man” by claiming that he was either asexual (quite an unnatural act, similar to such absurdities as chastity and celibacy), or without any sexual interests that mark all living creatures. As a theologian, I am neither offended or repulsed by the cartoons, but seen in them the plethora of human possibilities and the ultimate concept of god-man made flesh. But then, I am not from Poland and my bible is not censored.
Because that, like, makes total sense.
Interesting that when morality is at issue, we have educators supporting the flaunting of that morality and “students” testing the issue. Well, it is your right as it is my right to not hire any student from the U of O. I will, of course, pass this on with the hope that other employers will follow suit.
It’s just my small way of protesting your actions. Best of luck with your experiment.
*shrug*
Like I said, post what you want, that’s why we have comments.
No, I’m not daft. Human to a fault, but not daft. My apologies for taking it too far. Yes, you are a gracious host, and yes I should be directing all comments to the toonist. I’m getting sick of freedom infringement, and in my disgust of his whole issue have infringed your freedoms. It’s a tough balance to keep my freedoms without violating others under the same laws. I want mine, and you have a right to yours as well. Sorry.
Do I need to prepare another damn lecture on the difference between public and private spaces?
Are you daft? Just FYI, Sho and I pay for the website out of pocket, so it is not in any way publically funded. Being a private enterprise, posting here is roughly equivalent to sitting in my livingroom. I take that you’d want to toss rude houseguests out of your livingroom, and it’s your house, you do what you want. That’s the difference between a public and a private forum. The OC website is, in a technical sense, a private space.
That said, as obnoxious as I personally find the evangelizing, you know, go ahead (although please honor Olly’s request and post in verse). I’m not going to delete any of it, I’m not going to turn comments off, I’m not going to ban anybody, go ahead tell me about your omnipotent sky friend all you want. Sho and I are actually paying real cash money to allow you to continue doing that here. Not a lot of money, granted, but still.
“Hindering your ‘freedom of speech'”? Please, if this were a public forum and I were busy tearing down your pro-Jesus signage, you’d have a point. As this is a private forum and all we’ve done is suggest that, you know, perhaps, you might want to direct your ire at the folks who dreamed up the cartoons in the first place, I’d say we’re pretty goddamn gracious hosts.
I didn’t realize freedom of speech was a one way street. This all started because of “freedom of speech”. The question originally was “should someone be able to desecrate and smear another’s beliefs all in the name of freedom?” If one belief can be ridiculed, then all should be open to ridicule. If some, for political correctness, need to remain untouched, then all should remain untouched. I find it rather ironic that a website pushing for freedom of speech is asking those who choose to evangelize on this website to go to another, which, in case you missed it, is hindering our “freedom of speech”.
You’re free to choose. You’re not free not to choose, and you’re not free to choose the consequences of your choice.
Sorry I was pissed there for a moment. The whining is deafening.
legal challenges to the faith of our founders,
You know, that’s not all that accurate a statement really. Jefferson was, by most accounts, a Unitarian (although many atheists have cherry-picked some choice quotations). Franklin was basically a Deist. Mason was an Episcopal, but worked for the separation of Chuch and State.
To say that all of the founders were Christian is, frankly, wrong.
As a mother of a UO student, an alum, a former dope-smokin hippie duck, a preacher’s daughter and a world traveler, I can say with authority that nobody learns compassion by having the same bad thing done to them that they did to the other. Bad children learn respect by seeing it modeled, constantly and consistently, in their peers, in their community. The childish behavior of cartoons mocking religious beliefs may be free speech, but so is farting, belching and saying fuck. What purpose does it serve in these times of violence? We all used to hit each other when we were mad, but then we grew up. Hey?
I didn’t think this thread could possibly make any less sense than it has been doing recently. But oh, how wrong I was.
(Besides, Andy, wouldn’t you have been, like, ten years old in 1993? I think your conscience can be pretty clear as far as Waco is concerned.)
Meanwhile, I would like to take this opportunity to ask that our more religious visitors follow the example set above by Bettye, and provide their comments in verse.
Paul-
I’m appalled that my tax dollars went to murder the following people on the following dates:
Died February 28, 1993 in initial BATF assault on Mount Carmel
Winston Blake 28 black British
Peter Gent 24 white Australian
Peter Hipsman 28 white American
Perry Jones 64 white American
Michael Schroeder 29 white American
Jaydean Wendell 34 Hawaiian American
Died April 19, 1993 burnt or shot to death during FBI assault
Katherine Andrade 24 white American
Chanel Andrade 1 white American
Jennifer Andrade 19 white American
George Bennett 35 black British
Susan Benta 31 black British
Mary Jean Borst 49 white American
Pablo Cohen 38 white Israeli
Abedowalo Davies 30 black British
Shari Doyle 18 white American
Beverly Elliot 30 black British
Evette Fagan 32 black British
Doris Fagan 51 black British
Lisa Marie Farris 24 white American
Raymond Friesen 76 white Canadian
Sandra Hardial 27 black British
Zilla Henry 55 black British
Vanessa Henry 19 black British
Phillip Henry 22 black British
Paulina Henry 24 black British
Stephen Henry 26 black British
Diana Henry 28 black British
Novellette Hipsman 36 black Canadian
Floyd Houtman 61 black American
Sherri Jewell 43 Asian American
David M. Jones 38 white American
David Koresh 33 white American
Rachel Koresh 24 white American
Cyrus Koresh 8 white American
Star Koresh 6 white American
Bobbie Lane Koresh 2 white American
Jeffery Little 32 white American
Nicole Gent Little and unborn child 24 white Australian
Dayland Gent 3 white American
Page Gent 1 white American
Livingston Malcolm 26 black British
Diane Martin 41 black British
Wayne Martin, Sr. 42 black American
Lisa Martin 13 black American
Sheila Martin, Jr. 15 black American
Anita Martin 18 black American
Wayne Martin, Jr. 20 black American
Julliete Martinez 30 Mexican American
Crystal Martinez 3 Mexican American
Isaiah Martinez 4 Mexican American
Joseph Martinez 8 Mexican American
Abigail Martinez 11 Mexican American
Audrey Martinez 13 Mexican American
John-Mark McBean 27 black British
Bernadette Monbelly 31 black British
Rosemary Morrison 29 black British
Melissa Morrison 6 black British
Sonia Murray 29 black American
Theresa Nobrega 48 black British
James Riddle 32 white American
Rebecca Saipaia 24 Asian British
Steve Schneider 43 white American
Judy Schneider 41 white American
Mayanah Schneider 2 white American
Clifford Sellors 33 white British
Scott Kojiro Sonobe 35 Asian American
Floracita Sonobe 34 Philipino
Gregory Summers 28 white American
Aisha Gyrfas Summers and unborn child 17 white Australian
Startle Summers 1 white American
Lorraine Sylvia 40 white American
Rachel Sylvia 12 white American
Hollywood Sylvia 1 white American
Michelle Jones Thibodeau 18 white American
Serenity Jones 4 white American
Chica Jones 2 white American
Little One Jones 2 white American
Neal Vaega 38 Asian New Zealander
Margarida Vaega 47 Asian New Zealander
Mark H. Wendell 40 Asian American
Hi-
Welcome all the the OREGON COMMENTATOR blog.
NOT the insurgent’s.
Can someone make a website in their name and then you can all post your intentions there? I guarantee that the collective doesn’t read this website! Please, if you want to be effective track them down. I know you can’t post on their site, but that’s not an excuse to post evangelism here!
I get the whole thing about free speech and I am okay with that. But what I don’t agree with is that the Insurgent is funded with student dues. I would hate to think (if I were a student there) that I funded a publication that I disagree with and continually find offensive.
Bless your heart, dear Audra,
Unsurpassed in our nation’s history
the injustices allowed in our generation–
legal challenges to the faith of our founders,
debasement of Christ in “higher” learning.
Fools are they who study genesis as evolution–
from protein of “organic soup” man came to be–
parasites of earth, the host of which they feed
orbiting without purpose in a cosmic sea.
Every eye will see His Glorified Presence;
every knee will bow before His Majesty.
In awe of the Savior at the inevitable hour,
too late to repent at judgment of humanity.
I do not pretend to know it all, but this is what I do know:
There is a way that seems right to a man, but its end is the way of death.
The way of the wicked is like darkness; they do not know what makes them stumble.
For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteiousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, because what may be know of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them. For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse, because although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful, but became futile in their thoughts, and their foolish hearts were darkened. Professing to be wise, they became fools, and changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like corruptible man — and birds and four-footed animals and creeping things. Therefore God also gave them up to uncleanness, in the lusts of their hearts, to dishonor their bodies among themselves, who exchanged the truth of God for the lie, and worshiped the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen. For this reason, God gave them up to vile passions. For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature. Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was done. And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a debased mind to do those things which are not fitting; being filled with all unrighteousness, sexual immorality, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, evil-mindedness, they are whisperers, backbiters, haters of God, violent, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, undiscerning, untrustworthy, unloving, unforgiving, unmerciful; who, knowing the righteous judgment of God, that those who practice such things are deserving of death, not only do the same but also approve of those who practice them.
It is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment.
I truly feel sorry for those who think Christianity is a joke. God has set before us life and death and is begging us to choose life, but he will not make you, it’s a choice, free will.